European Car and audi!-good news for S5

[-Audi_tuning-]

So, looking through this months european car and found some interesting facts:
1. outgoing M3 0-62 in 4.8(so in those streetlight to streetlight, we keep up if not beat)
2. they did a face off, audi rs4 vs. new m3, last sentence goes as follows:
"...(the m3) will probably be able to outpace the RS4. But clearly, that will not be the case with the 90% of drivers for whom going quattro means going faster."
3. They basically say in the article that audi is better even with this new m3... glad someone said it
4. lastly, it looks like with a little tuning to the S5 engine you should be able to get the 420 that the RS4 achieves, this is good news to anyone getting into the S5 because now we can have a coupe for 50 grand(roughly) that will a) look better b) drvie better and c)be able to go out on stormy days o and beat the hell outa the m3... which to me just makes me happy cause people have been saying how much better the beemers are, well looks like the world is finally saying what everyone on here has been for the last X amount of years, the rings are better haha....[:D]

--If anyone has any other facts then throw em up, but this article made my night haha

-revision...the s5 engine and the RS4 engine are completely different but can be tuned to make the 420 the RS4 makes with some cash... and MTM's supercharger gives 500 hp anyways so it doesnt matter much...

[toaster]

1. new M3 0-62 in 4.8(so in those streetlight to streetlight, we keep up if not beat)

huh?

[Greeney]

BMW always goes a little high on there 0-60 time... Motor Trend was getting 4.1 - 4.3 with there M3.

[Maverick]

BMW always goes a little high on there 0-60 time... Motor Trend was getting 4.1 - 4.3 with there M3.

4.1-4.3 i think motor trend is talking smack right there. that's not possible even with the new M3.

[EuroB6]

the S5 base is 60k...most people will probably be paying 62-65k for one...any how in the world can you tune a 350hp car to 420HP...adding 70 HP is going to be hard..unless you go FI...im sure with chip/DPs/Exhaust, you can maybe get arond 35HP, but anything more is just too much on a N/A engine.

[houseofg]

The S5 base is $50k...$56k (MSRP) loaded...after running it through Audi's configurator.

[raulg_usa]

the S5 base is 60k...most people will probably be paying 62-65k for one...any how in the world can you tune a 350hp car to 420HP...adding 70 HP is going to be hard..unless you go FI...im sure with chip/DPs/Exhaust, you can maybe get arond 35HP, but anything more is just too much on a N/A engine.


The S5 base is $50k...$56k (MSRP) loaded...after running it through Audi's configurator.

It's weird how so many people are fixed on the 60k starting price for the S5.
I agree with "houseofg" on the 50k MSRP, since AUDI already announced the pricing on the S5 like a month ago.

STOP spiting out prices when you don't know anything at all. No more 60K+++ please, the MSRP is clear, is $50k USD, what is wrong with you people on all forums?

About moding the S5: it's no big deal if the engine is only detuned. This V8 is the same as in the RS4 but detuned to produce ~350hp. Sooner or later we should have the components to bring it back to 420 or close, it's just a matter of time. And $$$, since overpaying on this mod can hit the RS4/5 price with original parts (from dealers), something we would like to avoid.

[raulg_usa]

So, looking through this months european car and found some interesting facts:
1. new M3 0-62 in 4.8(so in those streetlight to streetlight, we keep up if not beat)
2. the did a face off, audi rs4 vs. new m3, last sentence goes as follows:
"...(the m3) will probably be able to outpace the RS4. But clearly, that will not be the case with the 90% of drivers for whom going quattro means going faster."
3. They basically say in the article that audi is better even with this new m3... glad someone said it
4. lastly, it looks like with a little tuning to the S5 engine you should be able to get the 420 that the RS4 achieves, this is good news to anyone getting into the S5 because now we can have a coupe for 50 grand(roughly) that will a) look better b) drvie better and c)be able to go out on stormy days o and beat the hell outa the m3... which to me just makes me happy cause people have been saying how much better the beemers are, well looks like the world is finally saying what everyone on here has been for the last X amount of years, the rings are better haha....[:D]

--If anyone has any other facts then throw em up, but this article made my night haha

Do you have a link or something? Can u post more info please? I can not find anything on their website, assuming I am hitting the correct website (www.europeancarweb.com)


Thx

[-Audi_tuning-]

It's weird how so many people are fixed on the 60k starting price for the S5.
I agree with "houseofg" on the 50k MSRP, since AUDI already announced the pricing on the S5 like a month ago.

STOP spiting out prices when you don't know anything at all. No more 60K+++ please, the MSRP is clear, is $50k USD, what is wrong with you people on all forums?

About moding the S5: it's no big deal if the engine is only detuned. This V8 is the same as in the RS4 but detuned to produce ~350hp. Sooner or later we should have the components to bring it back to 420 or close, it's just a matter of time. And $$$, since overpaying on this mod can hit the RS4/5 price with original parts (from dealers), something we would like to avoid.

found out today, a new exhaust system and a new intake system are what differs the rs4 and the S5 so the 70 hp difference is possible to make up and your right, why is everyone saying 60k?!?! its clearly stated 50k, 50,500 actually, and now its online at audi.com-build your audi...

[astris]

found out today, a new exhaust system and a new intake system are what differs the rs4 and the S5 so the 70 hp difference is possible to make up and your right, why is everyone saying 60k?!?! its clearly stated 50k, 50,500 actually, and now its online at audi.com-build your audi...
No. Waaaay off on this one.

The only thing the S5 and RS4 engine share is the displacement. That's pretty much where the similarities end.

Sorry, but you will NEVER get 70hp out of a S5 or pretty much any NA motor without adding forced induction.

Also, stock 335's can pull a sub 5 second 0-60. Performace wise, the S5 will not hang with the E92 M3 in any category. The S5 is beautiful inside and out though. [:)]

[BimmerConvert]

I would think that whatever it is that differentiates the RS5 from the S5, audi will make it at least moderatley difficult for people to tune it up to the next model level.

[07-Aythree]

the RS4 motor is a whole diff block...only similar things they share are displacement, like said before

[-Audi_tuning-]

No. Waaaay off on this one.

The only thing the S5 and RS4 engine share is the displacement. That's pretty much where the similarities end.

Sorry, but you will NEVER get 70hp out of a S5 or pretty much any NA motor without adding forced induction.

Also, stock 335's can pull a sub 5 second 0-60. Performace wise, the S5 will not hang with the E92 M3 in any category. The S5 is beautiful inside and out though. [:)]

k, well i think you should a, look at all the results for the 335, its half a second slower then the S5 stock so im not sure where the sub 5 came from, b, you should go ask someone that knows about the engine in the car, theres a little more then the displacement in common and c, the M3 is pulling 4.8 from bmw, which means it probably goes like 4.6 or 4.7 so the s5 can keep up... and we'll see if I get that hp or not...

why do people talk without doing the research first?!?![headbang]

[astris]

k, well i think you should a, look at all the results for the 335, its half a second slower then the S5 stock so im not sure where the sub 5 came from, b, you should go ask someone that knows about the engine in the car, theres a little more then the displacement in common and c, the M3 is pulling 4.8 from bmw, which means it probably goes like 4.6 or 4.7 so the s5 can keep up... and we'll see if I get that hp or not...

why do people talk without doing the research first?!?![headbang]

Lol. Ok.

The S5 engine is actually based off the Audi Q7 V8 FSI engine with a few differences. NOT a detuned RS4 engine. Do you think that just changing the exhaust and intake would drop 70hp... and magically lower the redline 1250rpms? Look at where peak torque is made in the two engines. One makes peak torque at 3500rpms and the other at 5500rpms. Do you think those differences are from intake and exahaust alone? Of course not. Those changes are indicative of different pistons and rods amongst others things (higher flow injectors, different valvetrain, cams, etc)... which the RS4 has.

As for the 335, it has been shown on the street and by independent mags that it's good for a sprint to 60mph in less than 5 seconds (around 4.8). This isn't news.

All this means is that the S5 is a great car, just doesn't have the RS4 engine. [up]

Oh yeah, let me know when you get that 70hp from an exhaust and intake.[rolleyes]

[-Audi_tuning-]

ok, i agree that its going to take me more then a bolt on exhaust and an intake, i think i was on drugs last night haha(jk) but i have from three seperate audi sources (a tech, and two sales guys) from different dealers too, the tech and one sales guy are friends that i know outside of a dealer setting and the other is from a dealership 200 miles away and they all state that its a detuned rs4 engine and that to achieve the 420 the rs4 puts out wont be inpossible... i kno it seems crazy but if you look at it, there are things that you can do to tune down an engine without putting too much time into it and removing these things will make a ton of power...

also, if you look into the beemer stuff, if their making less then five then bmw really sucks with this new engine cause its been tested at 5.5( i think dont quote) but i know its above 5 for sure and magazines have stated the same thing... so if they are that unpredictable that some will go 4.8 and some 5.4 I am so glad im gettin the audi!

[astris]

ok, i agree that its going to take me more then a bolt on exhaust and an intake, i think i was on drugs last night haha(jk) but i have from three seperate audi sources (a tech, and two sales guys) from different dealers too, the tech and one sales guy are friends that i know outside of a dealer setting and the other is from a dealership 200 miles away and they all state that its a detuned rs4 engine and that to achieve the 420 the rs4 puts out wont be inpossible... i kno it seems crazy but if you look at it, there are things that you can do to tune down an engine without putting too much time into it and removing these things will make a ton of power...

also, if you look into the beemer stuff, if their making less then five then bmw really sucks with this new engine cause its been tested at 5.5( i think dont quote) but i know its above 5 for sure and magazines have stated the same thing... so if they are that unpredictable that some will go 4.8 and some 5.4 I am so glad im gettin the audi!

The easiest way to tell it's not an RS4 engine is the characteristics. Like I was saying, look at where the torque is made. If it was just a detuned RS4 engine, but shared all the internals, the torque curve would be very similar. i.e. the S5 engine would not make peak torque until 5500 rpms... then hit redline at 7k. Where torque is made on a NA engine cannot be changed that drastically with just some ecu tuning. It's the internals.

It takes a special setup for a V8 to rev to 8,250. Audi would not take it's prized engine and just lower the redline. To "detune" an RS4 engine to 350hp would take a lot of work.

Forget all the technical stuff, do you think from a financial standpoint Audi would use it's highly developed, very expensive, flagship engine, "detune" it and put it in a regular S car? Or would they take an existing 4.2 FSI V8 that happens to already make 350hp, redlines at 7k rpms and put it in an S5. Hmmm... [;)]

I will say this now, yes it will be impossible to take a NA 350hp Audi FSI V8 to 420hp without forced induction.

As far as the 335, it's not that they are inconsistent, it's that they are underated. This is also well known.

[DeMOROlized]

ok, i agree that its going to take me more then a bolt on exhaust and an intake, i think i was on drugs last night haha(jk) but i have from three seperate audi sources (a tech, and two sales guys) from different dealers too, the tech and one sales guy are friends that i know outside of a dealer setting and the other is from a dealership 200 miles away and they all state that its a detuned rs4 engine and that to achieve the 420 the rs4 puts out wont be inpossible... i kno it seems crazy but if you look at it, there are things that you can do to tune down an engine without putting too much time into it and removing these things will make a ton of power...

also, if you look into the beemer stuff, if their making less then five then bmw really sucks with this new engine cause its been tested at 5.5( i think dont quote) but i know its above 5 for sure and magazines have stated the same thing... so if they are that unpredictable that some will go 4.8 and some 5.4 I am so glad im gettin the audi!

It's a detuned RS4 engine only in marketing terms. In reality it's the S4's engine with FSI added.

They can claim it's a detuned RS4 engine because the the RS4 engine is a substantially re-worked version of the S4 engine. Only in this sense is the S5 engine the same as the RS4 engine but detuned. But that's like claiming the 1997 A8 4.2 engine that puts out 300hp is the same engine as the RS4 engine, only detuned.

[raulg_usa]

Ok, it's clearly unclear for me now .. half keep saying it's a detuned RS4 engine, the other half don't agree with that.

no matter what, the car is still moving decent, motor trend and road& track did (both) full reviews, getting 4.8s for 0-60 and 13.3/13.4 at 105mph for 1/4mile. It's not extremely fast but it's good enough considering Audi didn't build the S5 against the M3 (which is much faster, btw), the S5 is a cruiser, a coupe, it's best points are looks and pleasure to drive, not racing. It's just another type, if you need the extra power go for the RS5/RS4.

In the case where this V8 is not easily/cheaply tunable I am more than happy, since I do not think making a 50k S5 faster or equal to the RS4 is a good idea for Audi. I mean, what would make the RS4/5 buyers shop for those cars anyway? I think keeping a clear segment for each car is very important if you want to keep your customers happy.

[astris]

It's a detuned RS4 engine only in marketing terms. In reality it's the S4's engine with FSI added.

They can claim it's a detuned RS4 engine because the the RS4 engine is a substantially re-worked version of the S4 engine. Only in this sense is the S5 engine the same as the RS4 engine but detuned. But that's like claiming the 1997 A8 4.2 engine that puts out 300hp is the same engine as the RS4 engine, only detuned.

Ehhh... yes and no. Yes on the marketing, not so much on a substantially reworked S4 engine. There are countless and huge differences to the point that there is barely any resemblance.

One of those huge differences is S4 engine has 5 valves per cylinder and the Audi FSI V8's have 4. That means an entirely different top end. The bottom end of the RS4 is completely different than the S4 as well. So, basically nothing really in common besides displacement.

From my reading, here are the differences between the RS4 FSI V8 and the regular Audi FSI V8's (Q7 and S5).

Crankshaft/connecting rods/pistons
Timing gear
Cylinder head
Oil supply
Engine cooling
Intake path
Exhaust system
Engine management

As you can see, pretty much the entire engine. I would image there are just as many differences, if not more, between the RS4 FSI V8 and the B6/B7 V8 (non FSI).

And yes, I can see your point and agree. [:D]

[astris]

Ok, it's clearly unclear for me now .. half keep saying it's a detuned RS4 engine, the other half don't agree with that.

no matter what, the car is still moving decent, motor trend and road& track did (both) full reviews, getting 4.8s for 0-60 and 13.3/13.4 at 105mph for 1/4mile. It's not extremely fast but it's good enough considering Audi didn't build the S5 against the M3 (which is much faster, btw), the S5 is a cruiser, a coupe, it's best points are looks and pleasure to drive, not racing. It's just another type, if you need the extra power go for the RS5/RS4.

In the case where this V8 is not easily/cheaply tunable I am more than happy, since I do not think making a 50k S5 faster or equal to the RS4 is a good idea for Audi. I mean, what would make the RS4/5 buyers shop for those cars anyway? I think keeping a clear segment for each car is very important if you want to keep your customers happy.
It's pretty easy to see...

Just look at the engine specs for the S5 and the Q7. You will see that they are identical. So, why would Audi build a second engine based off their expensive, exclusive, race-bred RS4 engine and detune it to exactly mock the characteristics of an engine they already produce for less? Answer: They wouldn't.

You second point is dead on. [up] I think the part to be most excited about in the S5 (besides the looks and interior), is the weight. Granted it's no lightweight by any means, but the numbers I've seen are over 200lbs lighter than the U.S. spec S4. That's a start for Audi. Let's hope they keep these numbers down for the U.S. market too.

FYI, U.S. spec RS4 weighs an obese 3957lbs!!! That's more than an S4! [:o]

[4-tified]

The S5 base is $50k...$56k (MSRP) loaded...after running it through Audi's configurator.

Slight discrepancy. [:)] Just a bit.
"loaded" implies pretty much everything offered.
If you add the Nav system and leave out the stainless inserts and vavona wood, MSRP comes to $58,740.

[houseofg]

Heck, someone in another thread or forum said they ordered one for $63k or so, too...unless they paid a premium (!?), I have no idea how these things are actually pricing out!

[raulg_usa]

It's pretty easy to see...

Just look at the engine specs for the S5 and the Q7. You will see that they are identical. So, why would Audi build a second engine based off their expensive, exclusive, race-bred RS4 engine and detune it to exactly mock the characteristics of an engine they already produce for less? Answer: They wouldn't.

You second point is dead on. [up] I think the part to be most excited about in the S5 (besides the looks and interior), is the weight. Granted it's no lightweight by any means, but the numbers I've seen are over 200lbs lighter than the U.S. spec S4. That's a start for Audi. Let's hope they keep these numbers down for the U.S. market too.

FYI, U.S. spec RS4 weighs an obese 3957lbs!!! That's more than an S4! [:o]

RS4 is only so heavy in US. Europe version is about 3600lbs, 1650kg, just like the new M3. Somehow Audi has to add more weight to US version for safety reasons. Hopefully the next RS4 will be even lighter with the same 200lbs the S5 is lighter than the S4. It should reflect in all model range on the B8 platform.

[-Audi_tuning-]

[QUOTE=As far as the 335, it's not that they are inconsistent, it's that they are underated. This is also well known.[/QUOTE]

ok, well topgear tested 5.4 on theirs and car and driver got i believe the same thing, is it faster then what bmw says, yea but so is every porsche you see on the road and audi too... basically they go by the ultra-conservative look which is take all you test vehicles and which ever has the least of anything, publish that.. this way you hava a better chance of someone gettin the car and being like hey, mines special cause its faster then it should be(it gives some people that warm fuzzy feeling inside ahaha). This means that the slowest 335i your gunna get will do the sprint in 5.5 or 5.4ish and the fastest will go it in 4.8ish, hmmm thats really unstable i can understand like if most of them went it in 5.3 or 5.4 but to say their going it in 4.8 is rediculous, i drove one, and my brother in his s60 R (5.5) was neck and neck with it, i had barely a 2 to 3 feet on him by sixty... and I drive better then he does.... so im not makin it up they arent that fast stock, potential, yes, until bmw voids your warrentee for chippin it hahaha then its up the creek without a paddle time haha

-also audi does this same tactic which means that the S5 will probably do better then4.8.... just something to think of while you drowl over the bmw that is so overplayed...

[DeMOROlized]

Ehhh... yes and no. Yes on the marketing, not so much on a substantially reworked S4 engine. There are countless and huge differences to the point that there is barely any resemblance.

One of those huge differences is S4 engine has 5 valves per cylinder and the Audi FSI V8's have 4. That means an entirely different top end. The bottom end of the RS4 is completely different than the S4 as well. So, basically nothing really in common besides displacement.

From my reading, here are the differences between the RS4 FSI V8 and the regular Audi FSI V8's (Q7 and S5).

Crankshaft/connecting rods/pistons
Timing gear
Cylinder head
Oil supply
Engine cooling
Intake path
Exhaust system
Engine management

As you can see, pretty much the entire engine. I would image there are just as many differences, if not more, between the RS4 FSI V8 and the B6/B7 V8 (non FSI).

And yes, I can see your point and agree. [:D]

That's exactly what I mean by substantially reworked. There are many changes, but at the heart of it, it's not a new design from the ground up. Audi took a tried and true engine & updated it with the latest technology. (Some of the changes are packaging issue and not technology related). It's an evolution (a significant one at that) of the S4 engine.

But the important is, we both agree that it's naïve to think you can tune the S5 engine to RS4 level. [:D]

[-Audi_tuning-]

im am not naive, just optimistic!

[astris]

ok, well topgear tested 5.4 on theirs and car and driver got i believe the same thing, is it faster then what bmw says, yea but so is every porsche you see on the road and audi too... basically they go by the ultra-conservative look which is take all you test vehicles and which ever has the least of anything, publish that.. this way you hava a better chance of someone gettin the car and being like hey, mines special cause its faster then it should be(it gives some people that warm fuzzy feeling inside ahaha). This means that the slowest 335i your gunna get will do the sprint in 5.5 or 5.4ish and the fastest will go it in 4.8ish, hmmm thats really unstable i can understand like if most of them went it in 5.3 or 5.4 but to say their going it in 4.8 is rediculous, i drove one, and my brother in his s60 R (5.5) was neck and neck with it, i had barely a 2 to 3 feet on him by sixty... and I drive better then he does.... so im not makin it up they arent that fast stock, potential, yes, until bmw voids your warrentee for chippin it hahaha then its up the creek without a paddle time haha

-also audi does this same tactic which means that the S5 will probably do better then4.8.... just something to think of while you drowl over the bmw that is so overplayed...
K.

Stock 335i's are a about as fast as e46 m3's stock, but I guess that's slow to you. You don't like bmw's, I get it. lol.

Btw, can you name a NA motor that has proven 70hp gains with bolt ons?

[4-tified]

K.

Stock 335i's are a about as fast as e46 m3's stock, but I guess that's slow to you. You don't like bmw's, I get it. lol.

Btw, can you name a NA motor that has proven 70hp gains with bolt ons?


Welllll, some drivers in 335i's can be as fast as stock E46 M3's.
But, for the most part the E46 M3 is still faster in all aspects.
Torque is a bit lower, hp a bit higher and weight is a good deal lower in the M3.

BTW, you like your SMG?
I don't like that trans. It's a great idea, but for everyday it felt too abrupt.
The Audi DSG though is SWEET. It's good to see BMW taking Audi's lead and making their own twin clutch "auto"/manual trans.

Even Mits has one in the new EVO X. Looks good.

[-Audi_tuning-]

K.

Stock 335i's are a about as fast as e46 m3's stock, but I guess that's slow to you. You don't like bmw's, I get it. lol.

Btw, can you name a NA motor that has proven 70hp gains with bolt ons?

what made you think that? haha, i like the 335, i do, but i get pissed when people try to compare the two, (so i compare the two making the audi out to look better cause i am bias haha) cause its apples and oranges, i mean look at it, rwd vs awd, a car thats fame comes from its design and beauty(not sayin the beemer isnt good lookin cause i think it is) vs a car that is famed for its engine... i do think the car has potential, get some air in that engine compartment and youll be good to go...

but just so we all kno, my best friend and I are taking this to the next level, we're going competition style on this debate, I ordered the S5 and hes ordering a 335i, we are gunna go stock, and then upgrade by upgrade, see what is better... haha i think we'll solve it! so im going to just let it go and see how this competition goes...

and as for the 70 hp to an NA engine, umm duh dude dont you know that the wing on the back of the civic add at least 50, and the tin exhaust another 30 easily.... and dont even get me started on how much cut springs get you!!! haha
- its gunna take internals and other stuff, i kno that... but im going for it, i want the MTM supercharger too...(this is yrs away ahaha)

[bunnn]

lol you have to extremely optimistic to think you can gain over 70hp on an NA without any force induction...this is of course based on how Audi made their NA cars in the past...i think bhvrdr(sp?) did a lot of work to bring his S4 to be close to 400 if not a bit more.....
as far as 335i competing against S5, hasnt there been videos of the 335i being just marginally faster then the S5 around the track? or even 0-60? honestly it doesn't matter which is faster, just enjoy your car....no matter which 1 you get, you should be happy... haha besides with our new gay speeding laws, i cant even drive that fast =(

[astris]

Welllll, some drivers in 335i's can be as fast as stock E46 M3's.
But, for the most part the E46 M3 is still faster in all aspects.
Torque is a bit lower, hp a bit higher and weight is a good deal lower in the M3.

BTW, you like your SMG?
I don't like that trans. It's a great idea, but for everyday it felt too abrupt.
The Audi DSG though is SWEET. It's good to see BMW taking Audi's lead and making their own twin clutch "auto"/manual trans.

Even Mits has one in the new EVO X. Looks good.
Weight is close between the two. Yeah, I would say the m3 is bit faster, but barely.

I love smg. You have to learn to drive it smoothly. It's definitely most enjoyable shifting at 8k during WOT. I never really use sequential mode.

I would love to try dsg in a high hp application. As long as drivetrain loss is around the same as a manual, it sounds great.

[AElucky83]

see this is what gets me..135i is supposed to like what 40K...and a S5 is 50K...meaning..anyone who spends 40K on a 135i should just step it up to a S5 instead. I know I would

[astris]

see this is what gets me..135i is supposed to like what 40K...and a S5 is 50K...meaning..anyone who spends 40K on a 135i should just step it up to a S5 instead. I know I would
No and no. LOL.

135 is the size of an a3 and not 40k. Pricing hasn't even been announced. 335 is 40k. 135 is not going be the same price as 335. 10k is a huge difference in price. Thats a $200 a month difference on a 5 year loan.

[Silververtu]

Why would people compare a 135i with a S5? It's totally different class. If people want a value performance car, they should think of vette Z06, Evo IX, or STi. Audi and BMW doesn't fit into this category.

[onelove0000]

Why would people compare a 135i with a S5? It's totally different class. If people want a value performance car, they should think of vette Z06, Evo IX, or STi. Audi and BMW doesn't fit into this category.

Who said the 135i or the S5 were value performance cars? They are luxury sports cars made for people that value both quality and performance.

[raulg_usa]

Who said the 135i or the S5 were value performance cars? They are luxury sports cars made for people that value both quality and performance.

I agree, but you still can't really compare the two. Way to different, for different people, different tastes/preferences.

[-Audi_tuning-]

i second that, the 135i and the S5 have nothing in comon, they arent meant to compete with each other and people looking at the S5 arent looking at a 135i or vice versa they are made for different markets...

[Shady Milkman]

what made you think that? haha, i like the 335, i do, but i get pissed when people try to compare the two, (so i compare the two making the audi out to look better cause i am bias haha) cause its apples and oranges, i mean look at it, rwd vs awd, a car thats fame comes from its design and beauty(not sayin the beemer isnt good lookin cause i think it is) vs a car that is famed for its engine... i do think the car has potential, get some air in that engine compartment and youll be good to go...

but just so we all kno, my best friend and I are taking this to the next level, we're going competition style on this debate, I ordered the S5 and hes ordering a 335i, we are gunna go stock, and then upgrade by upgrade, see what is better... haha i think we'll solve it! so im going to just let it go and see how this competition goes...

and as for the 70 hp to an NA engine, umm duh dude dont you know that the wing on the back of the civic add at least 50, and the tin exhaust another 30 easily.... and dont even get me started on how much cut springs get you!!! haha
- its gunna take internals and other stuff, i kno that... but im going for it, i want the MTM supercharger too...(this is yrs away ahaha)


what is there to solve? everyone know what happens when you mod a turboed car vs an NA

with a chip an S5 will get 15hp while a 335 will get 60whp

[4-tified]

see this is what gets me..135i is supposed to like what 40K...and a S5 is 50K...meaning..anyone who spends 40K on a 135i should just step it up to a S5 instead. I know I would

I have not seen $40k for a 135i anywhere but your post.
The 128i is supposed to start in the upper $20's ($27k) and the 135i in the lower $30's ($32-$33k).
If you get a $40k 135i you'll have every option including NAV, upgraded leather, etc... A base S5 is nice, but you have to add the options to make them "equal" in terms of what you get for what you pay.
Base price is a POOR method of comparison and is really pointless, unless both cars being compared have nearly the same level of equipment at that base price.

And, as far as performance...well, the 135i should be even faster and quicker handling than a 335i coupe, as the 1 series is a bit lighter.
So, the 128i and 135i will perform better than the A5/S5 respectively, but then, why even compare these cars? They are not in the same size or price category.

[ColdFusion]

ok, well topgear tested 5.4 on theirs and car and driver got i believe the same thing, is it faster then what bmw says, yea but so is every porsche you see on the road and audi too... basically they go by the ultra-conservative look which is take all you test vehicles and which ever has the least of anything, publish that.. this way you hava a better chance of someone gettin the car and being like hey, mines special cause its faster then it should be(it gives some people that warm fuzzy feeling inside ahaha). This means that the slowest 335i your gunna get will do the sprint in 5.5 or 5.4ish and the fastest will go it in 4.8ish, hmmm thats really unstable i can understand like if most of them went it in 5.3 or 5.4 but to say their going it in 4.8 is rediculous, i drove one, and my brother in his s60 R (5.5) was neck and neck with it, i had barely a 2 to 3 feet on him by sixty... and I drive better then he does.... so im not makin it up they arent that fast stock, potential, yes, until bmw voids your warrentee for chippin it hahaha then its up the creek without a paddle time haha

-also audi does this same tactic which means that the S5 will probably do better then4.8.... just something to think of while you drowl over the bmw that is so overplayed...


Car&Driver 335 0-60 4.9 sec
http://www.caranddriver.com/shortroadtests/13548/tested-2007-bmw-335i-coupe-automatic-specifications-page5.html

Edmunds 335 0-60 4.8 sec
http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpcontainers/do/vdp/articleId=117669/pageNumber=1

Road&Track 335 0-60 5.0 sec
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=4638

i have seen 1/4 mile times for the RS4 from 12.8 to 13.3

time, place, weather, driver vary and so will the performance of the car.

and Audi won't void your warranty for modding your car?

stop hating just because there are other good cars out there

[grjopo]

This thread is full of people who dont have a clue what they are talking about. Comparing the S5 to the new m3 is the biggest joke I have heard in a while. The 335 would be a better comparison, but not in a performance aspect. My little brother just bought a 335xi and with a chip and exhaust he beats my audi(which went 12.9 in the quarter) so for 45k he has a mid 12 second car that will beat a RS4. I am not saying the 335 is a better car, but performance the audi is not even close. 70hp from exhaust and intake, i don't even know what to say to that, and the s5 and rs5 engines share almost nothing, basic bolt ons will get you 20hp max on the S5 and as with everything else audi it will be overpriced.

[*B8]

i second that, the 135i and the S5 have nothing in comon, they arent meant to compete with each other and people looking at the S5 arent looking at a 135i or vice versa they are made for different markets...

they are not direct rivals but in some situations you will be considering one or the other.

My better half wants a sport car. One option is to keep e90 and get the S5 or replace e90 with B8-A4 and get either a 135, porsche cayman, Z4 or even an Audi TT.

Seems so far, the B8-A4 and 135 option is most likely (practical & fun).

[-Audi_tuning-]

This thread is full of people who dont have a clue what they are talking about. Comparing the S5 to the new m3 is the biggest joke I have heard in a while. The 335 would be a better comparison, but not in a performance aspect. My little brother just bought a 335xi and with a chip and exhaust he beats my audi(which went 12.9 in the quarter) so for 45k he has a mid 12 second car that will beat a RS4. I am not saying the 335 is a better car, but performance the audi is not even close. 70hp from exhaust and intake, i don't even know what to say to that, and the s5 and rs5 engines share almost nothing, basic bolt ons will get you 20hp max on the S5 and as with everything else audi it will be overpriced.

ummm firstly if you read the whole thread, you'd kno that its being compared to the RS4 not RS5 cause the RS5 is probably going to get the V10... and I said I kno its not just bolt ons, but it is possible, and as for your bro, good for him, im happy he can run 12s.... and tell me bmw stuff isnt equally overpriced....

[astris]

ummm firstly if you read the whole thread, you'd kno that its being compared to the RS4 not RS5 cause the RS5 is probably going to get the V10... and I said I kno its not just bolt ons, but it is possible, and as for your bro, good for him, im happy he can run 12s.... and tell me bmw stuff isnt equally overpriced....

Please explain in detail and with what mods how 70hp is possible without forced induction.

FYI the car has relatively high compression already. The car is FSI so fueling is a huge issue. Can't just swap injectors. Cams are pretty much useless and extremely expensive (the B6/B7 S4 guys have already tested this). Programing would be nearly impossible if by some means some one could accomplish these internal and fueling mods. Not to mention this would all be more expensive than superchaging the car and have less power on higher octane fuel.

[crespo]

the amount of misinformation in this thread is ridiculous... except for astris.

[-Audi_tuning-]

k, well heres some info... I WAS FRIGGIN RIGHT, new M3 goes 0-62 in 4.8 as quoted from EuroTuner Magazine, the newest issue, if you have an issue with it, suck it cause its in black and white so dont go and be like o well thats not true cause i dont want to here it bmw quoted it, and they ran the same time...so anyone saying that their stock 335i is doing 4.8 is on crack, cause there is just no way bmw would allow that!... i finally feel better knowing im right....

[crespo]

check anywhere else. C&D gt 4.4 in far from ideal conditions.

[astris]

k, well heres some info... I WAS FRIGGIN RIGHT, new M3 goes 0-62 in 4.8 as quoted from EuroTuner Magazine, the newest issue, if you have an issue with it, suck it cause its in black and white so dont go and be like o well thats not true cause i dont want to here it bmw quoted it, and they ran the same time...so anyone saying that their stock 335i is doing 4.8 is on crack, cause there is just no way bmw would allow that!... i finally feel better knowing im right....

Let me get this straight, you have the definitive answer because Eurotuner said so? hahahaha... Eurotuner? Really? The most respected mag in the industry. lol. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the mag, but for entertainment purposes.

Doesn't really matter anyways. Just wait until they are out on the street. There will be plenty of vids and timeslips. Until then believe what you like.

OH YEAH, there is a BIG M5 board meet this weekend at the airfield and there will be lots of vids. These are well known vids. Here's the list of cars:

BMW M3 V8 E92
BMW M5 E60
BMW M5 E60 Touring
CLK63 AMG
M3 CSL
M3 CS
335i Vishnu 1.47
335i Vishnu V2.0
SL55 AMG
997 C2S
997 Turbo
997 GT3 RS
996 Turbo orginal
M3 3,2 Limo
M3 E30 Europameister
M3 E46 manuell
M3 E46 SMG
Audi RS4 Limo "BMWH8R"
Audi RS4 Avant

This should tell you how fast the E92 M3 is. It would be cool if they could get a S5 there.

[-Audi_tuning-]

no, this is two magazines(eurotuner, and europeancar) and its not that hard to get a damn g timer....and moron can do it right, probably even you, and bmw itself.... and ummm skrew off, i could care what you have to say, thats now three individual sources that say it.... and if you dont like it, go to another thread....thx

[astris]

no, this is two magazines(eurotuner, and europeancar) and its not that hard to get a damn g timer....and moron can do it right, probably even you, and bmw itself.... and ummm skrew off, i could care what you have to say, thats now three individual sources that say it.... and if you dont like it, go to another thread....thx

Defensive much? Despite your attitude, insults and excessive use of periods, I still say be sure to check out the vids from M5 Board after this weekend. These guys are top notch and do everything from a roll to test the machines, not the drivers. They test cars against multiple other cars. All done at Koenigsegg airfield. Search M5 Board on youtube and it will give you a sample of their work.

Their runs are excellent displays of what these cars really do in comparrison. It's very interesting.