Track Car

[madrussian]

So if you were going to build yourself a car, strictly for the track what would it be?

And since if I put keep it reasonable, some guy will come along and suggest a McLaren as reasonable...

I'll say pick one for under 20k.... and then one thats just absurd if you'd like.

Tho I'm more interested in the reasonable under 20k ideas...

Miata, E36 M3, C5 Vette, Evo, etc?

[Feeesh]

I'd get a 993.

[ImaVunDerBrah]

e46 m3

Salvage title, ideally theft or flood so theres no body/structural damage. Interior would be gutted anyway and fancy useless electronics would be ripped out so I can't imagine that *most* flood salvages would fuck stuff up THAT badly.

[madrussian]

e46 m3

Salvage title, ideally theft or flood so theres no body/structural damage. Interior would be gutted anyway and fancy useless electronics would be ripped out so I can't imagine that *most* flood salvages would fuck stuff up THAT badly.

really e46 over e36, eh?

[roarincheetah]

Drag strip or road coarse?

[madrussian]

Drag strip or road coarse?

road course...

drag strip should prolly be another thread, but for that i dunno, i still think a dsm is prolly the cheapest.

[John1.8T]

i assume you want a track car as in something else you can drive on the street? Because I'm about to buy a Formula 500 for autocross and the occasional track event. They are pretty bad ass - www.f500.org

I would look at an old Porsche Boxster for under 20k. Mid-engine with nice power, lots of potential. Evo's and WRX's are around that price range too for a reasonable used one.

[roarincheetah]

corrado FTW! Those things are nasty

[ImaVunDerBrah]

really e46 over e36, eh?
absofuckinglutely. e46>>>>>>>>>>>>>>e36

The whole e36 gen is a blight on bmws otherwise gorgeous history. I'd take a 70s 2002, e30 m3, e46 m3, or a brand new 335, but anything e36 doesn't interest me at all. These conclusions are based solely on what I do/do not like, and have no factual support behind them. I just don't like e36s.

[madrussian]

i assume you want a track car as in something else you can drive on the street? Because I'm about to buy a Formula 500 for autocross and the occasional track event. They are pretty bad ass - www.f500.org

I would look at an old Porsche Boxster for under 20k. Mid-engine with nice power, lots of potential. Evo's and WRX's are around that price range too for a reasonable used one.

well no, it doesnt have to be street legal.

im talking gutting the interior, bare essentials, etc.

i mean id prefer it was a regular car, not a race car... but anything goes, this is open ended.

[madrussian]

corrado FTW! Those things are nasty

uh... fwd? hell no...

[jpsimon]

Build a spec Miata

[roarincheetah]

uh... fwd? hell no...

oh, I forgot you are not that good of a driver... my bad.

[madrussian]

oh, I forgot you are not that good of a driver... my bad.

wtf does that have to do with anything? you watch any racing or just pull shit out of your ass?

fwd sucks... its trash. rwd or awd...

cause you sure as hell see lots of people running lemans with fwd.

[j9fd3s]

Build a spec Miata

on any given day something like half the cars on the race track are mazda's.

and basically all of them are good track cars....

[jpsimon]

Tis true, and the miata's dominate much of the time at auto cross as well

[roarincheetah]

wtf does that have to do with anything? you watch any racing or just pull shit out of your ass?

fwd sucks... its trash. rwd or awd...

cause you sure as hell see lots of people running lemans with fwd.

lol, I was just trying to get a rise out of you. I wouldn't want ftw drive either. I was just messin.

[madrussian]

lol, I was just trying to get a rise out of you. I wouldn't want ftw drive either. I was just messin.

i was beginning to think you had lost all your marbles...

i concur tho rado = hottness but not for track car.

w/ a blower on one... oooo baby

[roarincheetah]

i was beginning to think you had lost all your marbles...

i concur tho rado = hottness but not for track car.

w/ a blower on one... oooo baby

Yea, I have seen some nasty ones

Hey, what about an E36 M3 gutted with a twin-screw supercharger kit.

[madrussian]

Yea, I have seen some nasty ones

Hey, what about an E36 M3 gutted with a twin-screw supercharger kit.

in all honesty, for me, e36 m3 is leading the race...

miata is just a dime a dozen like someone said and i dont think ill fit.

plus id like to hold to german roots... the only thing id consider instead of the m3 is an evo, but those are still 20k as opposed to 10k

[jpsimon]

Well if you want to dominate on the track (obviously driving skill is a factor), go the Evo route.

[ram74]

Evo

[d. wig]

absofuckinglutely. e46>>>>>>>>>>>>>>e36

The whole e36 gen is a blight on bmws otherwise gorgeous history. I'd take a 70s 2002, e30 m3, e46 m3, or a brand new 335, but anything e36 doesn't interest me at all. These conclusions are based solely on what I do/do not like, and have no factual support behind them. I just don't like e36s.

your crazy.... you obviously never drove one.. and i dont think he wants looks.. just a track car..

[duglas]

e36 M3... my friend just bought one on Ebay for $6000.. there is a 4 door E36 M3 locally for $9500...

motor is bullet proof after you fix the oil pump.. then brakes, electric fan and springs and shocks and you have a road course monster that you can drive to the track

[sean1.8t]

evo RS... im sure you could find one for 20 Gs somewhere

[ImaVunDerBrah]

your crazy.... you obviously never drove one.. and i dont think he wants looks.. just a track car..
Yup. I said my assessment was based solely on what I like, and not factual. I would want a track car that is both capable and appealing. Not just pretty, and not just a track car. Gotta be a mix of both... for me at least. He asked what we would build. Mine would be an e46 m3.

[madrussian]

e36 M3... my friend just bought one on Ebay for $6000.. there is a 4 door E36 M3 locally for $9500...

motor is bullet proof after you fix the oil pump.. then brakes, electric fan and springs and shocks and you have a road course monster that you can drive to the track

yeah ive been searching ebay for awhile... no 4 doors tho. only 2...

but im nowhere near ready to jump the gun one, just something that we've been talking about round here.

[j9fd3s]

bmw's do make good track cars too. people that drive em are weird though, we ran a night enduro one time (3 hours), and we were pitted next to this 4 car bmw team. at 2 minutes a lap, in a spec class, if you have to do more than change a tire, you're 2-3 laps down, and in a spec class, you just cant make that up.

so imagine my suprise when one of the bmw's comes in for a 60k service, in the middle of the race.... and of course they dropped something, like a spark plug, which is impossible to find at night....

[Capt. Obvious]

1st or 2nd gen AWD Eclipse/Talon. Or an e36 M3.

Or one of those badass racing semi-trucks they have in Europe.

[madrussian]

bmw's do make good track cars too. people that drive em are weird though, we ran a night enduro one time (3 hours), and we were pitted next to this 4 car bmw team. at 2 minutes a lap, in a spec class, if you have to do more than change a tire, you're 2-3 laps down, and in a spec class, you just cant make that up.

so imagine my suprise when one of the bmw's comes in for a 60k service, in the middle of the race.... and of course they dropped something, like a spark plug, which is impossible to find at night....

hahaha ooooops!

[HoRnYTuRbO]

hmmm
e30 w/ LS1 or SR20
240sx notch back w/rb25

[1997gtx]

Why not get an older AWD rally car from overseas?
--Adam

[madrussian]

Why not get an older AWD rally car from overseas?
--Adam

Think about that, is that really a feasible/sensible option? I'd be paying 1000's for freight which could go towards the cost of a car.

I'm not going to import a Lancia Delta so then I won't be able to readily get parts and end up paying what a M3 or Evo would've cost me.

[BavarianAudi]

get an e30 3 series (does not have to be an M3) you'll find parts easily and they are relatively light.

[rds0000]

Mustang GT. Cheap, nice HP, tons of mods for street and track. Also make a nice drift mobile. Or a 350z, again tons of mods etc. Or a Lotus Exige...

[BavarianAudi]

Mustang GT. Cheap, nice HP, tons of mods for street and track. Also make a nice drift mobile. Or a 350z, again tons of mods etc. Or a Lotus Exige...

350z's dont respond well to mods.

[roarincheetah]

350z's dont respond well to mods.

so true. I am not even impressed with the suprecharged ones I have seen.

[j9fd3s]

oh just one more thing: if you're racing vs doing track days, you've gotta prep the car to the rules. things like an sr swapped 240 put you in the unlimited class with the tube frame 1000hp cars....

its cool that these days, they have the time trial thing, where you can run anything, and they handicap it with a hp/weight scale.

[1997gtx]

Think about that, is that really a feasible/sensible option? I'd be paying 1000's for freight which could go towards the cost of a car.

I'm not going to import a Lancia Delta so then I won't be able to readily get parts and end up paying what a M3 or Evo would've cost me.


If that's the way you see it, then fine. But, to be a legal track track only, you're gonna need a roll cage, etc ... Have fun custom making one for an M3 ... Or, buy a shelf kit for said M3 or Evo ... You really think 20grand will go that far with an EVO? Perhaps getting a car from overseas is expensive in freight, but I would imagine that they can be pretty ballsy with a lot of the work already done to them. Someone who is spending 20 grand on a track only car better damn well know how to work on the car himself ... But, that's just me.
--Adam

[madrussian]

If that's the way you see it, then fine. But, to be a legal track track only, you're gonna need a roll cage, etc ... Have fun custom making one for an M3 ... Or, buy a shelf kit for said M3 or Evo ... You really think 20grand will go that far with an EVO? Perhaps getting a car from overseas is expensive in freight, but I would imagine that they can be pretty ballsy with a lot of the work already done to them. Someone who is spending 20 grand on a track only car better damn well know how to work on the car himself ... But, that's just me.
--Adam

Since you seem to have this all figured out, give me an example of a car over there that's race ready thats not here and I can get for 20k.

I dunno where you get your information but for 20k invested into an EVO I'll run circles around a shitload of cars all day long and have enough left over for a track bike, trailer, and case of beer...

Roll cages can be fabricated all day long and ready made kits are vastly available for both.

Glad you think it'd be helpful to know how to work on a car... here I was going to hope it never broke... [rolleyes]

[Capt. Obvious]

Simma down now kids, simma down.

[madrussian]

Simma down now kids, simma down.

im not heated... im just curious what logic he's using. before you blatantly throw my view points out, at least provide an example, no?

[rds0000]

I dont understand the sensitivity. He is Angry, and he is Russian. Its his way. Dont put it on the railroad tracks if you cant see the train coming....know what i mean?[;)] How about a Suby?

[HoRnYTuRbO]

What class do u want to run in?
for 20k i would do a e30 with a LS7, but if u want JDM tightness drive the stock evo for 20k.. lot of cars can be built for under 20k

fwd ? awd? rwd?

[madrussian]

What class do u want to run in?
for 20k i would do a e30 with a LS7, but if u want JDM tightness drive the stock evo for 20k.. lot of cars can be built for under 20k

fwd ? awd? rwd?

im not sure, im just thinking outloud. you are all car people, im gathering input.

i havent ever driven track days before... so this would be for a beginner up, but i also dont want a car ill have to replace after 5 races or something like that.

what options do i have as far as classes, racing, etc. etc.?

its not like im doing this tomorrow, so ive got plenty of time to get my ducks in a row...

[HoRnYTuRbO]

if you really want to do a Evo i would call up some places and see how the motor and tranny will actually hold up on a "racecar" do lots of home wrok before diving into it.
I was about to track my wagon but after hearing all the shops telling me that after 2-3 track days my motor would be toast is enough for me to just go and take pics instead of driving it.
I'm also thinking about building a car with my bro for drag and road course and i think the 240 is what I need, cheap and parts all over the place prob get every thing together for little over 10k with built motor. hard part is trying to figure out what motor i wanna go with... LS1 or big turbo RB25..
in the end its all about what u think is fun to drive

[1997gtx]

Since you seem to have this all figured out, give me an example of a car over there that's race ready thats not here and I can get for 20k.

I dunno where you get your information but for 20k invested into an EVO I'll run circles around a shitload of cars all day long and have enough left over for a track bike, trailer, and case of beer...

Roll cages can be fabricated all day long and ready made kits are vastly available for both.

Glad you think it'd be helpful to know how to work on a car... here I was going to hope it never broke... [rolleyes]

Sorry man, I didn't mean to insult you or come off abrasive ... I was merely brainstorming that I would think you could get a cool car from overseas for 20K ... I didn't / don't think you could do that much to an EVO for 20K ... You probably could as I don't know that much about them. It really depends upon what type of class you want to do. I, for one, would love to old school rally race ... So, when you said "track car", I immediately thought of something like this (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1122839010/1122839010ss.htm). I realize now that you're obviously looking for a newer car, with the whole 9-yards of comfort. I just don't get spending a lot of money for a car that's not going to be street legal -- and be spending most of the money on buying an expensive starting car ... That was my philosophy; i'm not trying to say your philsophy is wrong, I was merely thinking differently. Haze me if you'd like, but I have my audi for going fast with good handling. If im going out of my way to make a track only car, i'm gonna go with a crazy car. Best of luck whichever way you go, and with 20 grand, you'll have a monster any way you slice it.

Other things I was thinking of (and some are in the US) depending upon what class you want to race were:

Click Me (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1178583402/1178583402ss.htm)
Click Me Too (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1068158461/1068158461ss.htm)
Click Me Three (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1175785930/1175785930ss.htm)
71 Morris Cooper S (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1113204140/1113204140ss.htm)
A Bit Crazy, But Still Cool (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1141581348/1141581348ss.htm)
More of A Race Car (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1137061424/1137061424ss.htm)
This RSX in Canada Could Be Cool (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1178733619/1178733619ss.htm)
LOL, You Can Buy A 2 Million Dollar Robot! (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1166650664/1166650664ss.htm)
This Would Be Cool If You Had $35K (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1085535913/1085535913ss.htm)
For $100K, I'd pick this :) (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1134220369/1134220369ss.htm)
This Audi in Colorado Might Be FTW (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/other/1157551950/1157551950ss.htm)

As you can tell, I was thinking of a track-ready car ... This way, any money you have left over can be made to make the car faster, and /or have money for repairs. It just seems expensive to me to take an EVO or M3 and get it track-ready.

But again, that's just me...
--Adam

[1997gtx]

This one's good, too. (http://www.race-cars.com/carsales/porsche/1179435127/1179435127ss.htm)--Adam

[madrussian]

jeebus that website alone has redeemed you more than 10x through...

we're just coming from diff. sides of the page, tis all good tho... [up]

i think we're on the same page, but i want to build it myself to that point rather than get it pre-built.

i also want something thats a race car but in normal car form? not open wheel racer if that makes sense...

[Capt. Obvious]

Older Corvettes can be good for that too. And fairly cheap for an early-90's model.

[Capt. Obvious]

Or hell, since you already have one, mkI VW's are one of the best street course platforms in the world. Throw a cage, good suspension, wide steelies and a mildly built 16v in it and you'll be unstoppable.

[1997gtx]

I just think with cars like the Evo or even VW, you're missing on the light weight / class thing ... For an every day track car, and Evo would own all, and would be great ... Knowing what you want ... I say older M3 or older Audi, depending upon if you want AWD v RWD. I wouldn't think you would want FWD for tracking.
--Adam

[B18b1ex]

merkur XR4Ti with I think a turbo Volvo's head and a big turbo, It's cheap, parts should be cheap also, good balance, and fast as hell.

Volvo B234F Head Conversion for 2.3L OHC Ford

I think 400-500hp is pretty easy, with this setup.

[madrussian]

Older Corvettes can be good for that too. And fairly cheap for an early-90's model.

id love a vette... thats another option, i really want a c5... but the used ones are just now touching 20k... [:(]

and no to the mk1... hahaha. im selling the thing prolly, id like something w/ obd2 i think.

[S4 in_lowplaces]

either a

Nissan Skyline for track

and for a drag car

68 camaro.....

[jstrebel]

s2000

[OverSpun]

or just pull shit out of your ass?


usually thats where it comes from... IIRC in anatomy class....

[OverSpun]

350z's dont respond well to mods.

ha, thats not true at all. I have a friend that used to have a 650whp 350z... twin turbo, tons of stuff. That car was amazing, and they are great on the track too. Another friend of mine has 4, yes, 4 350z track cars. with some suspension work and some other mods, theyre great on a track

[xplosiveg06]

e36 m3 ftw , 240z , e30 m3 w/ s52 dropped in

[madrussian]

this thread will pretty much now never see another post... lol

[twinsnailsS4]

The E36 M3 IMO should be one of your top options based on all the parameters you have mentioned...and they go for pretty cheap, relatively speaking.

If you want to stay German and want something cheaper to build up, maybe consider a Porsche 944 (there's some on Craiglist in this area for $1k!!), or an Audi 90 Coupe quattro.

Other suggestions is an Audi TT...do a search as there is someone on the boards here that actually has a TT as a track car. Or, you can always look for a higher-mileage or salvaged B5 S4 near the 10-11k mark.

[RomanA6]

yup I was going to say a Porsche 944, they can be had REALLY cheap, but they are great light little cars; def. worth looking into

I think E36 is a great choice

anything AWD/RWD, light, turbocharged or V8 stock?

and OH, if you choose 944 - look around for the turbo version, with little $$$ they can be VERY fast, but you might want to look into a strong transmission; my cousin's friend's friend had one with mid 500hp and had to start off in 2nd gear, 1st was pretty much useless

same cousin has a 944 himself, that's N/A, that I have driven, and they are pretty cool, very nice

also, DO consider older VW's - like Rabbit, Golf MKII, GTi's, Scirocco's, they are great, light cars, they are VERY cheap, and you can mod the hell out of them - for track use or not

imagine an MKII with a 993 twin turbo engine and awd ...

[onemoremile]

Older Subaru Impreza 2.5 RS with a STi drivetrain swap would make a great track day car. If you're looking for a real racer or just want a better deal then get a copy of Grassroots Motorsports magazine and check out the classifieds in the back. You can buy fully sorted race cars with logbooks for a fraction of what they would cost to build.

[tonggi]

in all honesty, for me, e36 m3 is leading the race...

miata is just a dime a dozen like someone said and i dont think ill fit.

plus id like to hold to german roots... the only thing id consider instead of the m3 is an evo, but those are still 20k as opposed to 10k

i double that

[boost junkie]

My STi dominates almost everything on the track, but you probably won't find one for under $20k. E30/36's are great track cars, and there are a lot of options if you want to race it in the future. Same with the 944. If you want to build a serious track car, be prepared to buy a tow vehicle and a trailer too. I would start out with something a little more mild and build it up as your skill increases. Start off with some minor suspension/brake mods and street tires. Skill>hardware.

[onemoremile]

https://marketplace.grassrootsmotorsports.com/index/listings/category321.htm

https://marketplace.grassrootsmotorsports.com/index/listings/page221.htm

https://marketplace.grassrootsmotorsports.com/index/listings/page532.htm

https://marketplace.grassrootsmotorsports.com/index/listings/page636.htm

http://marketplace.grassrootsmotorsports.com/index/images/item593.htm

http://marketplace.grassrootsmotorsports.com/index/images/item538.htm

[palewhitemale]

nissan 240 w/a SR20DET and GT28rs kit on it. like 300 rwhp, light, readily available parts, and they handle great if you setup the suspension properly.

that's my choice for your budget.

-bill

[Mr.Black]

yup I was going to say a Porsche 944, they can be had REALLY cheap, but they are great light little cars; def. worth looking into

I think E36 is a great choice

anything AWD/RWD, light, turbocharged or V8 stock?

and OH, if you choose 944 - look around for the turbo version, with little $$$ they can be VERY fast, but you might want to look into a strong transmission; my cousin's friend's friend had one with mid 500hp and had to start off in 2nd gear, 1st was pretty much useless

same cousin has a 944 himself, that's N/A, that I have driven, and they are pretty cool, very nicealso, DO consider older VW's - like Rabbit, Golf MKII, GTi's, Scirocco's, they are great, light cars, they are VERY cheap, and you can mod the hell out of them - for track use or not

imagine an MKII with a 993 twin turbo engine and awd ...



ah finally someone mention the 944! also consider its jap clone the (older) RX7! these are great cheep rwd racers.
consider what the parts will cost for your racer (cage + suspention #1) as well as replacing broke prts ... including the tires (size matters) and some of the cars mention run sizes that r expensive. you will go thu them super quick 3-5 races. body parts availabilty and cost too. you wont pass tech with a smshed up ride. i used to run a 84 gti rabbit in SCCA ITB class it was fun but even the rabbit was too expensive.
*if you drive to the track ya better not break!, you'll have to tow it home cuz ya cant leave it at the track. and all the parts tools and tires wont fit in the car with you.
*unless you live real close to where your racing you'll need a motel room for the night before + race entry fee + race gas +++
*consider a tow vehice... this will add to the cost of your "racing program" with insurance and reg for both the vehicle and the trailer.
*helmet, nomex racing suit, shoes, food....++++
*it's been a few years but i would guess that barring any broken parts.
and driving your car to the track (semi st legal like i did) weekend with hotel will cost you $500+.

oh ... MADRUSSIAN fuk europe for a lancia, look in canada i've seen some in classifides and the shipping would be less to OH, or you maybe able to p/u!

[quattroanillos5]

datsun 510
dodge omni GLH (turbo)

[Ultrasport Steve]

So if you were going to build yourself a car, strictly for the track what would it be?

And since if I put keep it reasonable, some guy will come along and suggest a McLaren as reasonable...

I'll say pick one for under 20k.... and then one thats just absurd if you'd like.

Tho I'm more interested in the reasonable under 20k ideas...

Miata, E36 M3, C5 Vette, Evo, etc?


You could buy mine for $9900... :-)

http://www.audizine.com/gallery/data/545/775sears1106_001.jpg

[pms]

C4 Corvette

[Pointmeby]

Funny, since this is an Audi board no one mentioned an A4 or S4. I'd pass on an S4 because of the difficulty of working on the twin turbo motor. But finding a $5000 A4 and adding a $5000 stage III kit, suspension and brakes keeps you well under $20k with AWD. Gutted, the car could be 2500-2600 lbs. with 300+ HP. Plenty fun and reliable for track days. Very competitive in Time Trials.

[Sean Stibi]

lol, I have been thinking of this for a long time (way before I saw this thread) and decided I wanted to find a '97 or so A4 Quattro (prefer the 2.8) then spend a few thousand on building a performance engine (possibly top it off with a twin turbo setup) and going over the rest of the car making it stronger, strip it out, then have fun at the track.
Doing this should cost well under 20K and would be a very good car at the track.

[240ZT]

For a track only car under 20k I agree with a e36 M3 although that would put you in the upper end of that budget after all the track prep for the car. A E30 with a M50 swap would be a fun track car and a lot cheaper than the M3.

My choice would be a 240Z (I'm biased cause I own one). For 20k you can build a Z that will embarrass the high dollar machines. 2200-2400lbs, plenty of engine options, and there is plenty of knowledge on how to set the chassis up. Very easy to fix too if anything brakes.

[Sean Stibi]

Just so you guys know, I am going to be buying a B5 A4 and actually building a track car out of it eventually. That is what my post in the wanted section is mostly about. The car will be used as a daily driver until I am ready to go for it.
I am getting my racing license as soon as I can come up with the $2100 for it. Then join a friends racing team.

[TRU_PSI]

Porsche 930 turbo. [race]

[j9fd3s]

http://www.k2rd.com/teammidnight/

we've been racing those for about 2 seasons. the two cars were $1500, most of the go fast stuff, headers, exhaust, is just left over ricer stuff. suspension was like $2k, koni shocks, we experimented with spring rates.

rota gives us wheels

the cars arent super fast, but neither is anyone else, we'd be solidly midpack in the porsche challenge group, and they have race prepped gt3's